Zipper Neck Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Okay guys, I know tube is much more preferred, but I'd like to know why exactly. Well, I guess I know why, but I need help putting it into words.
Matt Mattson Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Less crackles, hisses, and pops. Good for Rice Crispys -- bad for amps.Also almost anyone can put a tube in, but I've been chasing down a cracked solder joint for a couple months (it crackles when the joint heats up).Good luck with getting your amp.
Zipper Neck Posted May 5, 2006 Author Posted May 5, 2006 I have an amp. I'm just trying to find a way to explain why it's better than what I had before.
Matt Mattson Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Afraid you'll have to go to a higher power than me, my son . . . Unfortunately, they seem to be a bit tight-lipped tonight.Maybe we've intimidated them. I didn't even think that was possible.Good luck.MM
SteveB Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 well, if you can't explain why it's better, maybe it isn't. Better is subjective. Some people say that tubes sound "warmer". Some people like the qualities of "Sag" and "Bloom" that are effects of a tube power section and rectifiers running at distortion levels. Some people say that Tube amps "cut through the mix" better, which I always thought was mostly an EQ problem rather than something inherent in the amp. Some people don't like tube rectifiers because they can effect the note attack, while others love that tube rectifiers can effect the note attack. It's also not possible to just categorically say that "tube amps are better than solid state". I've heard crappy versions of both, and great versions of both. I like tube amps, but I don't like all the crap that goes with them like weight, heat, variability depending on the power in the room, variability just cuz, and picking up bad AM radio stations. On the other hand, tube amps rule at getting musical feedback.
Brownsound Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Three wordsEven Order Harmonics Which is easily reproduced by solid state these days so thats not entirely it.Tubes have a feel more than a sound that makes them more musical. Its organic for lack of a better word. Tubes breath and along with the even order harmonics they introduce artifacts into the signal path that gives the tone that "certain" characteristic...wow...thats sure dancing around the questeion innit?
killerteddybear Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 The cajunboy has it right. Tube amps accentuate the 2nd order harmonic when overdriven. Solid state amps (I'm guessing PNP transistors; I believe FETs behave a lot like tubes) accentuate the 3rd order harmonic. Guess which one is more musical? Or maybe it's a pointless argument. Dial in a tone you like and practice your sweep arpeggios!
Disturber Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 You can't buy NOS tubes from the 60's for 300 dollars a pice for a solid state amp. That totally proves that they are no fun Seriously, for clean there are solidstates that are awesome. For dirty I have not yet played one that can match two or four red hot overdriven EL34's spitting out hell and fury that will kill newborn babies and call upon rain and thunder and the true Gods of Valhalla to send their wrath up on man.
lord nelson Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 If you play old school black metal or clean jazz. get a solidstate amp, otherwise a tubeamp sound better to my ears. The more you crank a ss amp the worse it sounds. The more you crank a tube amp,the sweeter it sounds.
BCR Greg Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 I have both.I gig with a solid state amp. It does exactly what I want.I grin, they clap, and all is right with the world.Your mileage may vary.
sirDaniel Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 We have the same dilemma in radiology. We still rely heavily on an invention from the 19th century even in todays "modern" silicon dominated world. The x-ray vacuum tube was invented in 1895 and hasn't been replaced yet. Good things happen in a vacuum. When you have a CT scan, there are 6 vacuum tubes spinning around you.
jwhitcomb3 Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Tubes or transistors are just one component of what makes an amp sound the way it does. I've had great sounding tube amps and great sounding solid state amps. I've been satisfied with the sound of each. It all depends on your tastes. Some people have a particular sound they are going for and will not be satisfied with an amp unless it nails that sound. For me, I look for an amp that can give me a wide range of sounds that I can easily access.I've ended up going with a solid state amp with a computer in it (Fender Cyber-Deluxe). I had to write my own custom editor to be able to tweak the compressor settings to my liking (you can't do it from the front panel), but that enabled me to simulate the tube sag well enough for it to feel right to me. I've spent hours tweaking the presets for my various guitars and have hundreds stored on my computer. But that was months ago: now I've got a solid set of presets in the amp that I can call up instantly and go.I'm not much impressed by mythology. I don't believe a guitar is better just because it says "Gibson", "Fender" or "Martin" on it, and I don't believe an amp is better just because it has tubes in it. I don't care if it is new or vintage. I don't care which famous performers play the brand...I'm not going to sound like them even if I have the identical gear. The guitar or amp just has to feel right to me, and I don't give a damn what name is stamped on it or what is under the hood.-Jonathan
MCChris Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 The more you crank a ss amp the worse it sounds. The more you crank a tube amp,the sweeter it sounds. This has been my experience as well.A former HFC member once made the analogy that playing a ss amp is like jumping up and down on concrete, while playing a tube amp is like jumping up and down on a mattress. I concur with that. A tube amp breathes, pushes and pulls and thus is more challenging to play.Plus, as others have said, tubes simply sound better to me.
Guest galejt Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 I have both.I gig with a solid state amp. It does exactly what I want.I grin, they clap, and all is right with the world.Your mileage may vary. Someone neglected to tell Greg that we drug the other inmates koolaid.
silentman Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Makes no difference. The only thing that matters is you like what you're hearing.
Scooter Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 In my (limited) experience, solid state amps get lost too easy. What I mean is, when I had solid state modelers, I could dial in great tones at home, but as soon as I lined up next to another guitar player, my sound was lost in the mix. Now, with tubey amps, I can dial in similar great tones at home, and they still shine when playing in the band.Also, the louder a tube amp gets, the better it sounds. Vice versa for solid state.YMMV
SteveB Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Also, the louder a tube amp gets, the better it sounds. Vice versa for solid state.YMMV thats presuming you want power tube distortion in your sound. A jazz guy might argue that 300 watt solid state is better because the amp won't lose the clean headroom as it turns up.Its also important to clarify that DSP Modelling is not even remotely the same as the old definitions of "solid state". It doesn't clip transformers or even FETS, it converts the incoming guitar signal to digital, processes it, and turns it back to analog.These discussions are really alot like the digital verses film debate in photography. In fact, both are different mediums, and attempting to use digital in the same way as film, or vice versa, doesn't work. You have to learn the correct way to use either media, and they both have pluses and minus.Only you can decide which works for you, and quite frankly everyone elses opinion is basically meaningless because they operate under a different set of needs, desires, and biases than you do. Trust your ears and how an amp feels to you to play.
ZR Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 ///////////////even in todays "modern" silicon dominated world//// Sir D, isn't that where Chris works?!
serial Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Agreed that a good tube amp will sound better in most circumstances. That being said, I am tubeless at the moment and likely won't look back anytime soon unless I find a cheap old one (like that'll happen) or a decent AC30. Frankly, for the situations in which I play (low volumes at home because everyone else is in bed and that's about the only time I have to play) or at rehearsals or gigs, I'll choose a solid state 100% of the time because of the ease of use and decent sound (T60 or now Duoverb). They're SO easy for gig situations and there's little that goes wrong and I don't have to maintain them with new tubes, etc.
Kilroy is all about... Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 this should helpful: MOJO from the electrons within the vacuum tubes and VIBES from the valves. i got a solid state VOX pacemaker, circa'64 , that chimes when dimed, yet a simple fender blues junior does both the pristine clean and the dirty-birdy, fatty-matty crunch, so my mileage does vary. note: fender is mack'd out with mullard el-84 and old school, black-plated RCAs 12AX7. recemmendation: spend the $$ and get a 15-watter , class-A tube amp and it should be suitable to your late nite jams. kilroy
LordOfTheThighs Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 I've only plugged into a few tube amps. I like what I hear through them. But typically they cost 3X what a good SS runs. For me personally, I have a hard time justifing that cost. I don't hear $1000 difference in the amps. NOT that I wouldn't like to own a nice tube amp, but it's a tough call to spring that money for my likings. I was looking for an image of my amp, and found this one, which is exactly what mine looks like ... head and 4 X 10 cab. I play through a Marshall MOSFET, and it sounds pretty good for my basement song butcherings.
straightblues Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Most if not all the recording you hear on the radio were made with tube amps. We have grown up listening to tube amps. Therefore, our ears are trained to appreciate tube amps. There are some great solid state amps out there and I have owned a few. But solid state amps don't sound the same as tube amps. I didn't say and don't believe they are better or worse but I can guarantee they aren't the same.BTW, I am a blues player and a couple of the great blues guys are well know for using solid state amps. Those would be BB King with his Gibson Lab series amps and Albert King with Roland Jazz Chorus amps.
Lockbody Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 Ahhh, a Lead 100 MOSFET. I had one of those "back in the day". Played many a punk rock show through that thing.
sirDaniel Posted May 5, 2006 Posted May 5, 2006 The more you crank a ss amp the worse it sounds. The more you crank a tube amp,the sweeter it sounds. This has been my experience as well.A former HFC member once made the analogy that playing a ss amp is like jumping up and down on concrete, while playing a tube amp is like jumping up and down on a mattress. I concur with that. A tube amp breathes, pushes and pulls and thus is more challenging to play.Plus, as others have said, tubes simply sound better to me. wolfy?
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