Andrew Posted October 23, 2012 Posted October 23, 2012 The Hamer stamped Floyds have always been Schaller's top of the line Floyd Rose. The Floyd Rose II is a joke and Hamer would have never used one of those on any of their USA guitars. Now, Hamer's Slammer series is another story and did use a Hamer stamped Floyd Rose II.The Hamer stamped Floyds have zinc blocks (not brass) and saddles (not steel) since they are OEM though... : (I think you will find that the Hamer stamped ones are FRIIs - the FRII (NOT off a Hamer) I have is identical to the Hamer model. Perhaps the confusion arises because there are proper Schaller/Hamer ones and licensed ones on asian guitars labelled FRII in the same way.Note as above that the Hamer stamped ones are a bit crap, not as good as the original FR.
zenmindbeginner Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 The Hamer stamped Floyds have always been Schaller's top of the line Floyd Rose. The Floyd Rose II is a joke and Hamer would have never used one of those on any of their USA guitars. Now, Hamer's Slammer series is another story and did use a Hamer stamped Floyd Rose II. The Hamer stamped Floyds have zinc blocks (not brass) and saddles (not steel) since they are OEM though... : ( I think you will find that the Hamer stamped ones are FRIIs - the FRII (NOT off a Hamer) I have is identical to the Hamer model. Perhaps the confusion arises because there are proper Schaller/Hamer ones and licensed ones on asian guitars labelled FRII in the same way. Note as above that the Hamer stamped ones are a bit crap, not as good as the original FR. They are not a bit crap unless you consider OEM Schaller stuff "crap". Here is a "Hamer stamped" Schaller licensed Floyd Rose Here is a regular non OEM Schaller licensed Floyd Rose (note that they are exactly alike) And now here is the Floyd Rose II (Note that it doesn't bear any resemblance to the Schaller licensed or the "Hamer stamped" version and is a completely different design). The only downside to having a "Hamer stamped" Schaller licensed Floyd Rose is that their saddles are zinc instead of steel and the block is zinc instead of brass.
KH Guitar Freak Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Interesting. I always knew the Schaller ones have diecast metal for the baseplates. Never knew the saddles were of the same material as well. Oh well. The diecast metal sounds less high endy and the focus is brought more towards the midrange me thinks... I had to replace the baseplate on mine to a current Schaller LFR. Retrofits down to a T. My original Hamer one has seen better days in terms of being able to keep my saddles in place. One of the screwhole is stripped to oblivion. The new baseplate does have the hardened steel inserts. Shouldn't give me threading problems no more for years to come...
Jem Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 And now here is the Floyd Rose II (Note that it doesn't bear any resemblance to the Schaller licensed or the "Hamer stamped" version and is a completely different design). The only downside to having a "Hamer stamped" Schaller licensed Floyd Rose is that their saddles are zinc instead of steel and the block is zinc instead of brass. Close but not correct as not all Floyd Rose II's have those stupid saddles, there are versions out there which are pretty well identical to the Schaller one that may have been OE on some Jap Charvel's of the period. If you Google 'Floyd Rose II' you'll get some images of what i'm on about (one pops up on a Carvin but i can't find the image when i click the thumbnail). Anyway, i know they exist as i've got one on one of my guitars.
Andrew Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 The proper Floyd Rose II is made by Schaller in Germany. They are identical to Hamer stamped ones complete with the same 'Made in Germany by Schaller' panel. The saddles were also the same in the early nineties, those above are much more recent.Post 89 Hamers are FRII by Schaller beyond any doubt. The reason I say they are a bit crap is because the screw holes strip in the plate, easy repair but it shouldn't happen. The FR original design also made by Schaller rarely, if ever, stripped.
zenmindbeginner Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 And now here is the Floyd Rose II (Note that it doesn't bear any resemblance to the Schaller licensed or the "Hamer stamped" version and is a completely different design). The only downside to having a "Hamer stamped" Schaller licensed Floyd Rose is that their saddles are zinc instead of steel and the block is zinc instead of brass. Close but not correct as not all Floyd Rose II's have those stupid saddles, there are versions out there which are pretty well identical to the Schaller one that may have been OE on some Jap Charvel's of the period. If you Google 'Floyd Rose II' you'll get some images of what i'm on about (one pops up on a Carvin but i can't find the image when i click the thumbnail). Anyway, i know they exist as i've got one on one of my guitars. There is much more difference in the Floyd Rose II vs Schaller's Floyd than the saddles... those saddles are interchangeable anyway. Different thicker baseplates and knife edges too. The proper Floyd Rose II is made by Schaller in Germany. They are identical to Hamer stamped ones complete with the same 'Made in Germany by Schaller' panel. The saddles were also the same in the early nineties, those above are much more recent. The attached picture of a FRII is a Schaller Floyd Rose II and one of the newer models at that. The Korean made FRIIs didn't say "Floyd Rose II", they just had "Floyd Rose" stamped in the baseplate The baseplates are thicker and the knife edges are different... not the same at all. The knife edges on the Hamer stamped and the Schaller Floyd are identical... not sure why you can't see that. Post 89 Hamers are FRII by Schaller beyond any doubt. The reason I say they are a bit crap is because the screw holes strip in the plate, easy repair but it shouldn't happen. The FR original design also made by Schaller rarely, if ever, stripped. You are talking about the difference between the OFR's steel baseplate and a zinc one with hardened inserts... just because Schaller OEM Floyds have zinc baseplates doesn't mean that they are Floyd Rose IIs. There is total daylight between a Floyd Rose II and a Schaller OEM Floyd Rose... not the same at all. The FRII and the OEMFR are two distinct models.
Andrew Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Arghhhh!I will say it again in capitals:A HAMER STAMPED FLOYD ROSE IS A SCHALLER FLOYD-ROSE II. END OF.It isn't complicated. Do you need a picture?1980s Hamer used OEMFRs, yes, but they weren't stamped Hamer. The current model FRII is simply different to the one made in the early nineties which is why you seem to be so confused.
Andrew Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Arghhhh!I will say it again in capitals: A HAMER STAMPED FLOYD ROSE IS A SCHALLER FLOYD-ROSE II. END OF. It isn't complicated. Do you need a picture? 1980s Hamer used OEMFRs, yes, but they weren't stamped Hamer. The current model FRII is simply different to the one made in the early nineties which is why you seem to be so confused. Best thing is I just found my Centaura! I don't want to argue so here is proof - The FRII is actually on a Diablo! Pretty identical I would say.
zenmindbeginner Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 1980s Hamer used OEMFRs, yes, but they weren't stamped Hamer. The current model FRII is simply different to the one made in the early nineties which is why you seem to be so confused.Schaller hasn't made the Floyd Rose II in years, there is no current model.Now, the Floyd Rose II did evolve from a single locking trem made from pot metal into a double locking trem that resembles what is today called a Schaller licensed Floyd Rose with hardened zinc saddles and inserts. That still does not make every Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose a FRII even though they appear the same.Arghhhh!I will say it again in capitals:A HAMER STAMPED FLOYD ROSE IS A SCHALLER FLOYD-ROSE II. END OF.It isn't complicated. Do you need a picture?Andrew, your dickishness is not needed... I wasn't rude to you, there's no reason to be rude to me.You should be nice to people who disagree with you... It's called character, develop some.
Andrew Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 I am not being intentionally rude, sorry for being abrasive. It is frustrating when someone keeps contracting you when you are absolutely sure of your facts and provide evidence. I would be remiss to just go along with the nonsense and that shows no character at all. Why can't you just accept that a Hamer stamped Floyd is a Schaller Floyd-Rose II? Look at the photo and what do you see?http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Bridges,_tailpieces/Electric_guitar_tremolos/Floyd_Rose_tremolos_and_parts/Schaller_Floyd_Rose_Locking_Tremolo_Complete_Set.htmlAnd they do still make the same model as the Hamer/FRII with 'Schaller' in the name panel.
Jem Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 The Korean made FRIIs didn't say "Floyd Rose II", they just had "Floyd Rose" stamped in the baseplateJust to fan the flames, i'm afraid they did. i pulled out one of my first builds and it's got a, what was probably made by Ping, FR II (it's 1000% not Schaller) and guess what it's got written on it after Floyd Rose.................well, no one like's a smartypants,
Bennyboy-UK Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Fortunately I know nothing about this at all.
cmatthes Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Just to fan the flames, i'm afraid they did. i pulled out one of my first builds and it's got a, what was probably made by Ping, FR II (it's 1000% not Schaller) and guess what it's got written on it after Floyd Rose.................well, no one like's a smartypants, Jemmie - you sure that wasn't a "Floyd Rose Eleven"?
Bennyboy-UK Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 I've got more drastic problems...The missus is making me watch Twilight.................and I don't wanna ! !
Jem Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Just to fan the flames, i'm afraid they did. i pulled out one of my first builds and it's got a, what was probably made by Ping, FR II (it's 1000% not Schaller) and guess what it's got written on it after Floyd Rose.................well, no one like's a smartypants,Jemmie - you sure that wasn't a "Floyd Rose Eleven"?That was a rumour put out by Mr Rose himself trying to sell more patent's , they only ever went to ten, eleven wasn't anymore wangee, no mater what Nigel says.
Andrew Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Just to fan the flames, i'm afraid they did. i pulled out one of my first builds and it's got a, what was probably made by Ping, FR II (it's 1000% not Schaller) and guess what it's got written on it after Floyd Rose.................well, no one like's a smartypants,As Richard Herring would say when loosing an argument...........'You can prove anything with facts!'
zenmindbeginner Posted October 25, 2012 Posted October 25, 2012 I decided last afternoon that I wasn't interested in Andrew's rebuttal and left the thread alone... totally changed my mind today.Okay, here's the deal. I love Hamer. Hamer is my HOMETOWN guitar company... I grew up in Arlington Heights. I bought my first Hamer when I was 13 years old with money I had saved from working a couple of Summers, birthday and Christmas money and with some dough I won on the Super Bowl XX. The Hamer name means a lot to me... I could give a rat's ass about any other guitar brand (except for Fender) and have remained as loyal a Hamer fan as anyone could be.When you say that the Hamer stamped Floyd Rose is simply the same Floyd Rose that was found on the cheap as dirt Kramer Strikers... you make me angry.The Floyd Rose II has a horrible reputation... largely known as shiite throughout the guitar community.The Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose has a decidedly better reputation. If the Floyd Rose II eventually evolved into the Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose and was replaced by it... why would anyone want to refer to today's Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose trems as Floyd Rose IIs? You keep telling me to look at the picture. The picture shows a Floyd Rose II that is identical to today's Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose AND our Hamer stamped Licensed Floyd Rose.Like I said, by your logic, every Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose is a Floyd Rose II. That's sort of a disparaging term and diminishes the Hamer brand down to using the same cheap ass Floyds that were found on imports and budget lines... is that your goal? Do you feel the need to slag Hamer by referring to the Hamer stamped Floyd Rose as the Floyd Rose II when it has 100% in common with the Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose?Floyd Rose II = glass half emptySchaller Licensed Floyd Rose = glass half fullThe Hamer stamped trem has everything in common with the Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose but only resembles the FRII in it's final double locking incarnation... logic says that it should be referred to as a Hamer stamped Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose since they have always been 100% identical.It is frustrating when someone keeps contracting youWell then, we'll work on your expansion.Why can't you just accept that a Hamer stamped Floyd is a Schaller Floyd-Rose II? Look at the photo and what do you see?http://www.stewmac.c...mplete_Set.htmlAnd they do still make the same model as the Hamer/FRII with 'Schaller' in the name panel.Yeah, they absolutely do....... It's called the Schaller Licensed Floyd Rose.MuahhahahahahahahahahahahThe Korean made FRIIs didn't say "Floyd Rose II", they just had "Floyd Rose" stamped in the baseplateJust to fan the flames, i'm afraid they did. i pulled out one of my first builds and it's got a, what was probably made by Ping, FR II (it's 1000% not Schaller) and guess what it's got written on it after Floyd Rose.................well, no one like's a smartypants,I clearly don't own enough Korean made hardware... thanks for enlightening me.
Studio Custom Posted October 25, 2012 Posted October 25, 2012 Back on topic, has anyone ever seen a Hamer embossed Schaller that also has the threaded inserts? I haven't.
Andrew Posted October 25, 2012 Posted October 25, 2012 I post again a clear(ish) photo of a Schaller Floyd-Rose II identical to a Hamer version. Please do look at the photo closely - I see that the FRII you are talking about is a more recent incarnation than the 1990 version I am talking about; I don't doubt that now they have dropped the II from this model but in 1990 that is what is was called. FRII in the 20th century is not the same as FRII in the 21st. All you are really saying is that I shouldn't call it a FRII even though that is what it says on the top? But that is what it is, a 1990 FRII. The earlier, original Floyd that Hamer used until 1989 was a little different, thinner baseplate, different arm attachment, different string-clamp screws, bigger hex-key needed for the posts' adjustment. What they are now calling OFR isn't, it is in fact the later version (FRII in 1990). I don't think you are being obtuse, I just think you haven't seen an old Floyd-Rose II before so I understand why you are sticking to your guns. I have tried not to be abrasive this time as I am sure that didn't help before. Could others please chime in to end this?
coolfeel Posted October 25, 2012 Posted October 25, 2012 Could others please chime in to end this? Sure will - just drop it...
atquinn Posted October 25, 2012 Posted October 25, 2012 Back on topic, has anyone ever seen a Hamer embossed Schaller that also has the threaded inserts? I haven't. Yes. And also, the Floyd that came on the Diablo I bought from Kim Keller some years back. So apparently at some point, they got a stash of them with the threaded inserts. - Austin
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